Ep. 95 - Brad Goes to the Carolinas, Hal Coffel Strikes Again & Other Things!

Brad is back from a Carolina adventure, bringing stories from his trip through North and South Carolina! Then Travey cracked open the Bird Gospel of Hal Coffel for another wild find and a whole of a lot more!
Another episode of Busted Knees & Pretty Trees is here. Hit play, follow along, and Keep on Sauntering!

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Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:09

Hello! Welcome to Busted Knees and Pretty Trees. As always, we thank you for coming along. And if you find that you like our show, give us a follow at I'm Doing This For You Patty. Busted Pretty on IG, YouTube, and Blue Sky. Check out our bustedpretty.com for links to all that. Plus our growing list of guests and links to their respective conservation organizations. If you find one that tickles your fancy, why don't you send them a few bucks? If you don't have that kind of chatter laying around, I believe they accept the elbow grease of motivated volunteers. Any support is much appreciated. I'm Travis J. White, and with great relief, I'm happy to say Bradley Greer is with me, back on the turntables. Sadly, we won some tears. Sadly, we do not have Patty with us in studio this episode. But Patty, you are still in our heart. Last week, Brad told me and Patty he was leaving to go get a cart and a SIGs, and not to worry. He'd be back in a flash. He never came back. We waited up all night, wondering, is this all our fault? Were Patty and I unlovables? Dark times for the both of us. Come to find out, Brad was just hanging with Sarah. Brad must have felt comfortable leaving the complexities of busted pretty podcast operations in the hand of his two highly capable and trusted teammates. Long story short, instead of trying to understand our dad Brad, we chose to rebel against this feeling of abandonment in the form of anarchy. And the recording failed to meet even our lowest standards. Just a couple salty sailors without a skipper, not even a compass. But fear not, Brad is back, and everyone should be hearing us loud and clear. We've got a fun show ahead. I don't know if Brad planned for it, but I'm going to be asking him about his trip through the Cumberland Gap and on to Charleston. And everywhere in between. So I did something interesting. I decided to reach out on Reddit with our podcast. And so I wrote wrote a nice little thing about it. And I got banned from a subreddit for uh promoting something. And I posted I just posted like, hey, this is Best of Knees and Pretty Trees. We've been doing this, we're almost on our hundredth episode, uh, kind of explained what we do, and I mentioned like our latest guest that uh of note was like Bill Wade from the Association of National Bar Grangers, and they were they just banned me, and I felt really bad about it.

SPEAKER_05 3:14

I could see it because it would be like, yeah, I would feel bad too. But I could see it being like if they were to allow that, everybody would be like, check out my podcast, come to my store.

SPEAKER_02 3:26

If you're ever in this city, check out the and uh but I noticed a lot of them now have n no promotion. Yeah, I don't know. That really but some made it through. I'm telling you right now, the ones here's the ones that banned us. Uh R Wilderness backpacking. Oh damn uh R Wilderness camping and hiking, and camping and hiking. You guys have lost an ally on this day. But hey, subreddit, uh R hiking gear. You're cool. Yeah, you kept us around, and uh all we're trying to do is just spread the love. We make no money off of this. Yeah, it's a labor of love. And I've even mentioned that in my description of our podcast.

SPEAKER_05 4:20

We can't even afford an SD card to record fast enough when I'm not here.

SPEAKER_02 4:24

We get very angry at each other because we don't have enough money to do what we do. But we still do it because we love it.

SPEAKER_05 4:32

I do, I am very curious. So, how does it feel to have recorded an episode in the dark now? Like it's lost to the world. You and Patty sat down here, hammered it out, and nobody's I didn't I don't even know what you guys talked about.

SPEAKER_02 4:48

You know, maybe like a few years ago, just yeah, really, really tear me out.

SPEAKER_03 4:57

What a chapter ass. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 4:59

Well, you know what? It's just like, well, what are you gonna do about it? Like, oh, we had fun, I guess.

SPEAKER_05 5:05

Did you have fun recording it? We did it was like a game night, right?

SPEAKER_02 5:08

Yeah, we had a game night, a full game night. Damn. Who won? Oh shoot. Oh my gosh, dude. There was it was probably the most insane out-of-the-box one we've had yet, for sure. Oh boy. And I don't even know if it we might you I don't know. It might pop up in a a wet dark basement somewhere in a hundred years. At least maybe clips of it.

unknown 5:38

Wow.

SPEAKER_05 5:39

Oh, there's the news panther. Was he here last week? And the in the dark and the in the lost episode.

SPEAKER_02 5:48

He didn't want to have anything to do with that shit. Oh.

SPEAKER_05 5:51

We need to come up with a name for it. Like in community, they call it the gas year or whatever. We need to come up with a name for that episode.

SPEAKER_02 5:58

The what now?

SPEAKER_05 6:00

The episode that we'll never see the uh never make it to air. We need to come up with a name for it. We'll get there. Yeah, we'll figure something out. So I today's for the News Panther. I have a couple just quick hit stories. They're kind of updates. So you've heard me talk about Jackie and Shadow, right? The bald eagle duo that's in um Big Bear Valley.

SPEAKER_02 6:26

Is that the one that you have the camera on? Yeah, they have where they're like covered in snow, just like guarding the eggs.

SPEAKER_05 6:32

That's the famous, like one of the famous videos of Jackie. Yeah. Big Bear got like 40 something inches of snow, and she stayed incubating the eggs the whole time.

SPEAKER_03 6:42

Yeah, that looked really cool. Yeah. So that was Jackie.

SPEAKER_05 6:45

Yeah, that was Jackie. They've been on basically they took over this nest. Jackie was there first, and she had a man called Mr. B. And then the next year she kicked his ass to the curb and brought in Shadow. What made her do that? Um, I don't know. If I I think if they feel like you're not providing enough, you're not catching enough while she's roosting, yeah. And Shadow's known like Shadow's known as an excellent fish. Like he can he can catch a fish with the best of them. Yeah. So can't blame her. So since 2018, Jackie and Shadow have been on YouTube. Like their nest has been video like recorded and streamed from the Friends of Big Bear on YouTube. So all of this to say, I have some unfortunate news. Oh. We lost Jackie. Jackie passed away. Mama? Yeah. She like they have become, because of this nest, one of the most recognizable pair of bald eagles in the country. Like, I guarantee every news channel did a story about this. Jackie passing away.

SPEAKER_02 7:47

Uh yeah, Wayne 15 certainly did.

SPEAKER_05 7:49

Yeah. Um, it's a big deal. It's a it's a bummer. Because they've even just like raised awareness through this cam. And they're like just seeing how because you see them lay eggs, roost the eggs, how they get through that, the eggs hatching, the eaglets are there, you're watching, like you can watch all of it on the cam.

SPEAKER_02 8:10

It's awesome. Watch them as fledglings, like yeah, trying to learn how to fly.

SPEAKER_05 8:15

Yeah, yeah, they're like flapping their wings, and I've seen a couple like, and then there's always you'll usually miss when they fledge, but then Friends of Big Bear posts clips of them fledging and doing their first flight, yeah, and then like flying with shadow or something. It's just super cool. So yeah, they Jackie passed away uh in the early hours of August 10th at Oji Raptor Center, and she was there for three weeks and just getting intensive medical care. And it still seems kind of the the ailment. Well, it seems kind of strange because she was found unable to fly, and they're pretty sure she was got in a fight with two sub-adult bald eagles on the shores of Big Lake or Big Bear Lake, and kind of like a territorial thing, like she was defending her territory. And I I feel like there were some like some may have come to the nest or something throughout the year, too, because they did have a failed clutch earlier in the year, and ravens got into the eggs. So this happened, they found her, but then she was like low white blood cell count. There was just all kinds of things going on with there, and it seems weird that that would come from a fight. So everybody uh everybody's kind of measure that. Well, and this Raptor Center was kind of like a like this is what they do when she was sick, yeah. Yeah, they measured that, like, yeah, and so there was all kinds of things going on with her, and like they just couldn't figure out how that would all come from uh a fight with other eagles, so it's still kind of a mystery, like how what what exactly happened. But either way, she passed away. She was they approximate her to like being 14 years old. Wow, and the average lifespan's 15 to 25, so they took her one a little early. Uh she's known to have laid 25 eggs on that live stream. Yeah, which only 10 of which hatched into eaglets.

SPEAKER_02 10:14

What are the what's the average, you think?

SPEAKER_05 10:17

You know, I don't know. I know that two eggs per clutch is pretty normal. If they have three eggs per clutch, they're prospering. And then why if there's one egg, they're not doing so hot.

SPEAKER_02 10:29

What percentage of eggs do they expect to hatch?

SPEAKER_05 10:33

I don't know. Like this seems like she was a normal because like 25 eggs, 10 hatched. And because like that year with the snowfall, those didn't hatch. Oh and then they didn't even have a clutch or they didn't have any the next year either.

SPEAKER_02 10:47

Like they just couldn't keep them warm enough.

SPEAKER_05 10:49

Yeah, I think so. Yeah. Probably. But here's so that they they name all of the Eagle What's the Hatch? Because you know you have Jackie Shadow, and they have their submissions online that you can submit names, but then the local Big Bear Elementary School votes on what they're gonna name the Eagle It's pretty cool. So here's to the 10 names over the years. One was BBB. I don't I didn't get that one, like three Bs. Uh that was the first one, and then Stormy, Cookie, Simba, Spirit, Misty, Sunny, Gizmo, and then this year is Sandy and Luna, which this happened. We've come back around, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:36

Stormy, Luna, Sandy, here we go.

SPEAKER_05 11:39

Um, and like I know Sonny and Gizmo made it last year, and there were three eggs last year. Gizmo? You couldn't be more spot on. That's awesome. The 90s are back, baby. And that that was two females too, Sunny and Gizmo. Uh, you know, like it's it, it's every animal that's in trouble, like having more females is definitely good because you know, like males can get multiple females pregnant. So and this happened when Sandy and Luna fledged. So Shadow was like, take he was running the house, taking care of bringing them fish, because they would like go, like you know, fly off the nest, perch somewhere. And in my mind, I always feel like they're just like, Whoa, what the fuck? Like, how did I get over here? And what am I gonna do now? Yeah, so they'll call, and then the parents normally bring a fish to them, and so Shadow was taking care of them still on his own. But you know what? That dirty dog, the day after uh Jackie passed away, spotted with goddamn KD1, an eagle that's banded, female subadult in the nest with Shadow. They will that fast? That fast, which it was three weeks. She'd been gone, she'd been gone for three weeks. That nest is still warm. She still got poop in that nest. But yeah, so and it's funny because every time I turn the stream on now, it's Shadow with Katie One.

SPEAKER_03 13:09

Like it's like it's like they're how you feel about it.

SPEAKER_05 13:11

Oh, it's tough. I know Sarah's pissed. She's like that little that slime ball. How dare him!

SPEAKER_02 13:17

Fucking snack.

SPEAKER_05 13:18

They haven't even put they haven't even figured out what to do with Jackie's body yet, and he's out there with KD One.

SPEAKER_02 13:24

So KD1 is from I think he knew about KD1 way before she died, dude. I don't know.

SPEAKER_05 13:33

Oh shit. So they uh uh she's from that, like kind of within 100 miles of the area where she was hatched, and she was banded when she was in the Eagle at KD1. Oh, no kidding or at least I think you know, I don't even know if they're concerned locally 100 miles. They said, like, I was watching a thing on KD1, and this biologist said that when they fledge, and then so they'll stay in the area for a while when they fledge, but then they disperse and they just go off and explore like it's almost like in college when you do your overseas year or whatever. Like they'll go expl, they'll they'll go explore everything.

SPEAKER_02 14:07

What do they call it? The Bounder Springen or something.

SPEAKER_05 14:14

Uh oh shit, what is it? That's the Abbish. Hop hop spring. Rumspringer, yeah. Perfect. So they go on their rumspringer, and then they typically come back to the area and then start looking for a territory that they can claim. So um, so that's what they think happened. Like she might have left and then came back, and now she's like within the range of her home nest. And you know, she just rolled up, she's like, damn, this nest looks nice. And then, like, within a little bit, shadow flew. And I mean, I think he could probably fight her and like this is my territory. I'm waiting for Jackie. Get out of here.

SPEAKER_02 14:58

Like, were there eggs when she died?

SPEAKER_05 15:01

No, they had hatched, yeah. That was um, that was Luna and Sandy. They had just fledged, so they're still in the area, probably. I don't know if they've dispersed the area yet.

SPEAKER_02 15:13

Man, he had to have a call out. Like, you just don't go flying into a nest.

SPEAKER_05 15:18

Perfect. But it was it is sad. I mean, it is it is a bummer because they were like an iconic duo. I know I've been watching them for like three or so years, so R.I.P.

SPEAKER_02 15:27

Jackie, she left a good legacy. Those bald eagles know what they're up against. Yeah, they just gotta keep reproducing. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 15:37

All right, so and uh more uplifting. Yeah, this is one quick uplifting news. Do you remember what happened September of last year? There was a competition, a bracket competition.

SPEAKER_02 15:51

Uh it wasn't birding, was it?

SPEAKER_05 15:53

And it's about things preparing for winter.

SPEAKER_02 15:56

Oh gosh, I don't know. Oh, do you have a sound bite?

SPEAKER_05 16:01

I was gonna be the Big Bear contest week is coming up. Oh, the fat bear. Okay, yeah. Fat Bear 2026. Um, so the camera has gone live on Brooks Range. You can go to explore.com and there's a YouTube. Or I think you can just go to YouTube and search like Explore Fat Bear. This is in Alaska. Yeah, this is at the famous Brooks Falls and Katmai National Park. You can visit there and you can like there's a platform where you can overlook uh the Brooks Falls. Yeah. And there's dozens. Like if you go to the camera, most times the later on in the year, I think the more, but there'll be dozens of brown bears.

SPEAKER_02 16:41

Yeah, it's kind of crazy when you see like a photograph when it's behind the people on like the catwalk or whatever, and you see all these bears and all these people looking at them.

SPEAKER_05 16:50

Yeah, catmai's a dream trip some year. You have to fly into catmai. I don't think I don't think you can drive there. Can you boat in? Not um, I don't think so. Um, but yeah, so they've uh last year Chunk, if you remember, Chonk won. Well he clocked in at like 1200 pounds and he had a broken jaw when Fat Bear Week started.

SPEAKER_02 17:10

Yeah, I remember that.

SPEAKER_05 17:11

Yeah, and so he's been spotted. He made it through the winter. Somebody spotted him in the spring. So Chonk's probably gonna be back. He may be back already. Check out the live stream, see if he's there. He's got a big scar across his snout, and his jaw is still just a little fucked up. Like it's a little crazy.

SPEAKER_02 17:27

Did he get that with a fight with another bear? Yeah, that's what they assume. Yeah, and man, what a trooper.

SPEAKER_05 17:32

Yeah, so yeah, start paying attention. And he's eating more than anybody.

unknown 17:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 17:38

They said there was a number. It was like they uh the average one eats like a hundred plus pounds of fish that like that in a day, 120 pounds of salmon per day.

SPEAKER_02 17:50

Yeah. Dude gets after it. It's crazy. He's not asleep until it's time to hibernate.

SPEAKER_05 17:56

I do, and this is one thing that I I think I always learn and then I always forget. Do you know what the difference between a brown bear and a grizzly bear is?

SPEAKER_02 18:05

A brown bear and a grizzly? Yeah. I thought they were the same thing.

SPEAKER_05 18:10

Is it size? Pretty yeah, like it's um what they eat in location, but because of what they eat, it is like size too. So brown bears are larger than grizzlies. They eat salmon and they live near the coast, and grizzlies live further inland and eat insects, vegetation, and berries. So grizzlies are a little bit smaller than the brown bears, at least in Alaska. Oh. Um, so like so. Are these brown bears we're watching? Not grizzlies. Well, no, these are brown bears. Grizzlies refer to brown bears, like they're the same as brown bears, but they live inland. Oh. So like all grizzlies are brown bears, but not all brown bears are grizzlies.

SPEAKER_03 18:52

That's where. Yeah. What a son of bitch.

SPEAKER_05 18:55

So, like Kodak, Kodiak Island, like those are brown bears. Those are like if they're eating salmon, living coastal, they're and and I always forget. I always forget.

SPEAKER_02 19:05

Grizzlies are brown bears.

SPEAKER_05 19:07

Correct.

SPEAKER_04 19:08

Okay, so the grizzly man.

SPEAKER_02 19:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 19:13

Actually, maybe should have been the brown bear man. Yeah. Because he was around Katmai.

SPEAKER_02 19:17

Oh. Wow. Huge revelations on busted knees and pretty trees.

SPEAKER_05 19:22

Then, like at Yellowstone, there's grizzlies. And Teton, there's grizzlies.

SPEAKER_03 19:26

Because they're inland. Because they're inland.

SPEAKER_05 19:28

Yeah. And they're not as big. I mean, they are very inland. So it's cool. I like I always keep just like every now and then, like at work, or if I'm like going through photos or something, I'll have the Jackie and Shadow cam on, or I'll have now, I'll have the cat my explorer.com fat bear contest cam on. Because you see all kinds, you see all kinds of crazy shit. You'll see like bald eagles and stuff on the cam. It's pretty cool.

SPEAKER_02 19:53

Is there uh another name for like black bears?

SPEAKER_05 19:58

Uh they can be brown-faced black bears. Please and like red. I was just listening to this guy. This is a real tangent. There was this guy on he was doing an interview, and he was like an old game warden in Alabama, but he hunted and a guided hunts, bear hunts in um Alaska, black bear hunts. And he's one of the first people that came up with trail camps. So they asked, like, well, what'd you guys do before trail camps? They would find like a path where the bears would walk through, they would doll hooks out so they weren't sharp, and they would set up like a line with a hook. Let me back up real quick. Hunters would be like, I want a brown faced black bear, I want a red black bear, like a the different color, because that's the you know, that's like a dependent on what they eat. Uh, I'm not sure. I think some of them, I don't, I don't know. I don't know. But so they would scrape this hook as they're walking by and get a little tuft of hair on it. And then this hunt, this guy could be like, hey, look, this was like in the 70s, like, hey, look, we got a brown faced black bear, there's some fur. But then he'd be like, well, is it a nocturnal one or a daytime one? Oh my god. So then they would set up a trip line with a watch. And they said he said well, this was a construction thing or something that they took, and it the trip line would pull like a piece of plastic out of the watch and it would stop the time on the watch. So you knew what time like a bear walked by. What year is this? This was the 70s. Okay, and then this is the guy, he eventually started making trail cameras. No, like he was one of the first ones to make. I can't. Ah, I wish I could think of it.

SPEAKER_02 21:28

He really started from the ground up. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 21:30

Yeah, pretty wild. Cunters drive, you know, technology. Right. They're crazy. You gotta tell me we're nocturnal daytime. Yeah, it's pretty badass. And now look at what trail cams are now. You can get photos on your phone from a trail cam.

SPEAKER_02 21:47

Well, I d uh was doing some walking in the woods around my parents' place, and just so happened upon a trail camp. Oh, that nobody knew about nobody knew about.

SPEAKER_05 22:00

Did you pull the SD card on it?

SPEAKER_02 22:01

No, it was one of the I don't think it I didn't have access to the port. It was one of the newerest, pretty like locked up. Did you steal it? I would have ripped it down. No, I just took a good picture of it and then took it to my dad. And well, I immediately thought, oh, it's cousin Ted's. Uh I didn't think much of it. And then I took it to my dad, and he's like, No, I don't remember anybody asking me to do that.

SPEAKER_05 22:24

Yeah, it sounds like you got a new trail.

SPEAKER_02 22:27

Well, he he was like, if it's not Ted, because we had Ted came over like that day, and I asked, like, you got a camera out there? No, he didn't have one. And uh, and we were like, Well, maybe it's Shane who lives across the street. Maybe it's Joe Bob down the road. He called Shane who lives across the street. And it was his Joe Jane.

SPEAKER_01 22:49

Oh, that's awesome.

SPEAKER_05 22:51

What an asshole.

SPEAKER_01 22:52

That's fantastic. I'm glad you didn't. I'm glad you didn't.

SPEAKER_02 22:55

I'm keeping an eye on the woods.

SPEAKER_05 22:58

So what was your dad? Was your dad okay? Are you cool with that?

SPEAKER_02 23:01

Shade across the street. I mean, it's fine. As long as you ask, you don't give a shit. But it's kind of weird that he just stuck it on there without asking.

SPEAKER_05 23:09

Yeah, damn.

SPEAKER_02 23:10

Way gumby.

SPEAKER_05 23:12

All right. Well, we have an episode to get to today. And let's get to it. And we didn't mention Debbie's joining us. She may chime in here and there.

SPEAKER_03 23:20

You may have heard her earlier. Yeah. It was a surprise.

SPEAKER_05 23:22

Travis forgot to introduce. I brought her along today. So welcome to the episode. Yeah, let's take a break and get back into it.

SPEAKER_02 23:29

Yes, sir.

SPEAKER_05 23:38

All right, and we're back. I feel like I can't do as good of a job as Patty Cakes. He comes in ripping and roaring, doesn't he? Or right now we should say he's at his fantasy football draft where he's known as Asterix Patrick's, that you busted out on him one week and caught him off guard.

SPEAKER_02 23:56

Yeah, I guess. Um are we just trying to punch him?

SPEAKER_05 24:01

I feel like we got to have throwing an Asterix Patrick's for his family.

SPEAKER_02 24:04

I'm okay with that.

SPEAKER_05 24:05

Yeah. But anyways, so you you've been officially going through the the gospel of Hal Cawful, right? The bird Pembroke. Penn is that Pennville.

SPEAKER_04 24:17

Pennville. Uh in J County.

SPEAKER_05 24:19

Which we drove through on our way to Mary Gray Bird Sanctuary. That we did. Yes. And um my I was looking for the statue of Hal Cawful, but I didn't see it anywhere.

SPEAKER_02 24:29

Yeah. My aunt Cheryl lived in Pennville. Oh, nice. So I've got a little bit of a connection to it. She know him? Did she know Hal Cawful? They hook up. Who died in 1948?

unknown 24:44

Damn.

SPEAKER_02 24:44

Actually, I don't know if that's right. But yeah, I have found I've been reading through, I've been dividing everything into uh which organization he was writing to, which what started it off was the Indiana Audubon Society. And uh so he was the birdman uh of Pennville in Jake County there. He was uh and he was also a board member uh of the Indiana Audubon Society.

SPEAKER_05 25:14

What at one point and wasn't didn't Whitney say the guy that he was corresponding with is kind of their Earl Brooks, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 25:21

He was the president of the Indiana Audubon Society at the time. Nice. And um from what I've read, he Earl uh admired um Hal very much, but also demanded that he get more memberships in J County. Found a letter that kind of leads into something else kind of outside of uh Hal and Earl here. But this letter is from Earl Brooks, the president of the Indiana Audubon Society, to our bird gospel uh man here, Hal Kawell, and this is 1930.

SPEAKER_05 26:06

Damn, 1930, coming out of the depression.

SPEAKER_04 26:08

Hal Kauffel also, R.A.P. 1936. I did do some fact checking there.

SPEAKER_02 26:14

1936.

SPEAKER_05 26:15

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 26:17

So 1930. Six more years for poor Hal after this letter. That's what I was thinking.

SPEAKER_05 26:22

I'm trying to like think of we came out of the prohibition, came out of the depression, the Nazi party starting up in Europe.

SPEAKER_02 26:31

We had the what the Roaring Twenties, they called them.

SPEAKER_04 26:34

Yeah, then the wait, when was the Great Depression? The old Dust Bowl.

SPEAKER_02 26:43

I feel like that's kind of around there somewhere.

SPEAKER_05 26:46

Uh the Great Depression. Oh, it did like it lasted from 1929 to 1939. So Dust Bowl was the name. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:55

You're doing a great job.

SPEAKER_05 26:56

There we go. There we go. So this was we were at the middle of the depression in the dust bowl.

SPEAKER_02 27:02

What else to do? The bird. Mr. Al H. Coffle. Oh, yes. Pennbill, Indiana. Dear Mr. Caw. Well, here I am working on the 1931 annual meeting and gathering items for the 1931 bulletin, and also trying to collect enough money to erect a memorial to Isaac Washington Brown in Rochester next summer. All three are progressing very well for the time of the year, but I must keep at it. I just wondered if you could see fit to appear on our programs this year at Muncie on May 8th through the 9th for a talk or paper not to exceed 15 or 20 minutes on whatever subject you see fit to choose. However, give me the title of the paper as soon as convenient so as to enable me to fit it in for a balanced program. Can you do it? We are having a bill introduced in this session of the legislature asking that the cardinal be made the state bird. If you have any interesting ornithological facts that could with profit be in the bulletin, send them along. Sincerely yours, Earl Brooks.

SPEAKER_05 28:24

Damn that Northern Cardinal. Yeah. I wonder what his interesting facts could have been. They made it for life. Like they had to prove, like, put up a case that the cardinal should be uh Yeah, because think if you were like the senator representing Allen County and somebody put the cardinal up, you'd be like, what's so what do you what do you got? What's so cool about the cardinal?

SPEAKER_02 28:46

Well, they're red and they're all over the place. Well, what's cool about them, man? I'd be like, well, that's pretty cool.

SPEAKER_05 28:52

Sell me.

SPEAKER_02 28:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 28:54

Yeah, they're bright red.

SPEAKER_04 28:56

Year round. Year round.

SPEAKER_05 29:00

Yeah, there's a few of them.

SPEAKER_02 29:01

Well, the one thing I want to pull out of this little letter here is the memorial to Isaac Washington Brown. That name popped out to me. That's a little nugget. Yes. And I was like, well, if you're gonna build a memorial to somebody, they must be pretty memorable, right? Yeah. Well, I guess I don't know. If you have a build a memorial, they're not that memorable, I guess, because you have to make sure you remind people.

SPEAKER_05 29:30

Well, yeah, but it's probably better than you planning to build one after you die. Like people or other people are planning to build it for him after he died.

SPEAKER_02 29:40

He died in 1914. Oh yeah, he's already dead. It's been a while. But I want to tell you about this, Isaac Washington.

SPEAKER_05 29:50

Roar at twenties.

SPEAKER_02 29:52

So here's what they said about uh Colonel Isaac P. Brown. The bee and bird man. When I first typed in uh about Isaac Brown, some website came up and it was just basically his uh like the historical obituary that was written. And it's I don't know, it's it's kind of ridiculous. Colonel Isaac P. Brown, the bee and bird man, is dead. He died at his home in Rochester, Indiana last Wednesday night of acute indigestion. Whoa. Colonel Brown was here last May and gave one of his lectures in the Chesterton Public School building. He was 66 years old and was born in Carroll County, Indiana. He served in the War of the Rebellion in the 135th Indiana Infantry. Besides the widow, he leaves two sons. Mr. Brown was famous all over the Middle West for his lectures on birds and bees and appealed especially to school children. He had spoken in 26 states. Mr. Brown was at one time a protege of Helen Gould, now Mrs. Shepard. He had a good salary and saved money, which he later lost on the Board of Trade. He died a comparatively poor man before he began lecturing. He studied law, being at one time with Joseph Rabb, former Appellate Court judge. Mr. Brown's last lecture was a duplicate of his first and was delivered at Logansport 13 years after he had spoken at the same time. Well, the reason that he came back to do that uh speech was to be when they passed the migratory bird treaty act of 1918. And it's one of the oldest and most important U.S. federal wildlife protection laws. It implements international treaties to protect migratory birds and makes it unlawful to take, pursue, hunt, shoot, wound, kill, capture, or collect, possess, sell, purchase, board, barter, import, export, or transport protected migratory birds. Their parts, including feathers, nests, or eggs, without a valid permit from the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service.

SPEAKER_05 32:26

Yeah, it was the genesis to the Endangered Species Act.

SPEAKER_02 32:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 32:30

That came like 50 years later.

SPEAKER_02 32:33

It took that long. That was the uh last speech that our burden bee man gave.

SPEAKER_05 32:39

And when you say bee, you're talking like bumblebee, honey bee.

SPEAKER_02 32:42

I would assume I didn't see much information about his bee work. It was mostly bird work. Hmm. He wrote a uh he didn't teach us sex ed because you might think. But he wrote a book called Birds That Work for Us. And he had a saying that every bird has its bug. And he was a champion.

SPEAKER_05 33:09

Uh is that like he came up with that and tried to coin it as a phrase? Well, I don't know. The early bird gets the worm, but he was like every bird has its bug.

SPEAKER_02 33:18

But he was a champion for not uh killing birds because they're excellent uh insect controllers and everything like that.

SPEAKER_05 33:27

Whereas like how Koffa would shoot an owl so he could look at it.

SPEAKER_02 33:31

Only in certain circumstances. I mean, yeah, back then they didn't have a canon R7. They didn't know how many there were. Yeah. There's gotta be billions. This can't mean anything.

SPEAKER_05 33:44

We must preserve it for science.

SPEAKER_02 33:47

Well, yeah, I thought that it was awesome that this led me down a different kind of road of you know, another person uh from Indiana that was a big proponent of protecting our birds and stuff.

SPEAKER_05 34:01

He must have been pretty young in the War of the Rebellion. He died in 1914 in the 60s, and the Silver the War of the Rebellion was 1965. He must have been a young fella.

SPEAKER_02 34:14

Well, that's usually when you go and that's the five that's the five years right there. But I think he wa I think his unit was uh because I looked into that a little bit, and he their you he didn't see any combat, but uh he was like morale.

SPEAKER_05 34:35

He was like, I'll think you're burning.

SPEAKER_02 34:37

No, they were his unit was like guarding Sherman's like equipment and their and their you know stuff like that. Whatever. But yeah, so that's uh all I had on my man Isaac.

SPEAKER_05 34:50

It's pretty cool, and like because there was a lot packed into that. The one of the most famous Indiana Audubon directors, the Cardinal becoming a state bird. Yes. And then mentioning.

SPEAKER_02 35:02

Oh, I have uh the picture too. That memorial.

SPEAKER_05 35:06

Oh, he's a handsome fella. You sent that photo. He's very handsome.

SPEAKER_02 35:09

Oh his mustache? Are you kidding me? Just uh I know we need to move on, so I wanted to just mention this uh the memorial that the Indiana Audubon had put up. And it says it says, erected and dedicated by the Indiana Audubon Society and friends and loving memory of Isaac Washington Brown, known over the United States as the Burden Bee Man. He traveled by various methods all over the country and spread the gospel of bird protection, which has been of untold sentimental and economic benefit to mankind, erected in 1931.

SPEAKER_04 35:54

Damn.

SPEAKER_02 35:55

I mean, that's pretty monumental statement. Yeah, it is. That's saying a lot.

SPEAKER_05 36:01

I wonder who wrote that. I wonder if how the Errol Brooks? Errol Brooks, yeah. That's that's quite the own. Yeah. Damn. I do it. Does always make me wonder what birding would have been like back then. You know, I'm sure the bins sucked. If they even had bins, probably not.

SPEAKER_02 36:20

They definitely had uh telescopes. Oh, yeah. Or what do they call those? Um what the pirates use?

SPEAKER_05 36:29

Um, I can't think of the name of it.

SPEAKER_02 36:33

Anyways. Yeah. But it kind of like like the the idea of conservation has been around for so long. And it just every time I go through this and read through it, there's there's just more and poor more people that I see that have championed this.

SPEAKER_05 36:52

Do you wear white gloves when you're going through the correspondence?

SPEAKER_02 36:55

Hell no, I get all busy Doritos. What do you mean 1929?

SPEAKER_05 37:01

This is not supposed to be Oh, spyglass. That's what pirates used. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 37:08

That's what we need to find out. Were they using spyglasses? Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 37:12

Or it might have been like a lot of mainly sounds. I bet those dudes could whistle a pretty mean bird call back then. Because you didn't have Merlin to play a sound. I heard this bird. I don't know what it was, but it made the sound.

SPEAKER_02 37:26

They do like a whistle. I'd be like, Brad, what's a cardinal sound like?

SPEAKER_05 37:29

Oh man, I couldn't I could not do a cardinal.

SPEAKER_01 37:40

You kidding me?

SPEAKER_05 37:41

That's like their chirp that they do.

SPEAKER_02 37:44

Alright, we'll hit that in post.

SPEAKER_01 37:46

Yeah, I'll add an actual cardinal call in there.

SPEAKER_05 37:51

So tell us about uh your trip out east. Me and Sarah had a pretty whirlwind east coast tour along the Appalachia. Whirlwind, you say? Oh, it was quick. Like we hit we were in an area called Beach Mountain, North Carolina.

SPEAKER_02 38:06

How long were you gone? We didn't even know.

SPEAKER_05 38:08

Um I left on a Wednesday and came back on a Tuesday.

SPEAKER_02 38:13

So almost a whole week. One day short of a week. Yeah. And actually, depends. Depends.

SPEAKER_05 38:21

Our headquarters in North Carolina was a place called Beach Mountain that I've never heard of. Uh it's like a ski resort area for in the wintertime. There's uh Banner Elk, uh Beach Mountain. It's in the Appalachians, like northeast of Asheville, North Carolina, like in that same area. Boone, North Carolina, Appalachian State.

SPEAKER_02 38:42

So you're still up in the hills and stuff.

SPEAKER_05 38:45

So it's super cool area. One highlight was we did a hike at Grandfather Mountain State Park. And I'll tell you what, Travis, I was I was I was humbled on my trail planning.

SPEAKER_02 38:58

What kind of hike was this?

SPEAKER_05 38:59

So this was a a just Wait, what did you plan for? Well, this was just a regular day hike, and and I kind of this was um like we were with Sarah's family and her brothers, and so I usually just kind of take a backseat. I'll pick up whoever falls out. And we were trying to make it to this one peak because they're uh Callaway Peak, I think it was like the highest point on Grandfather Mountain, and it was there was like a tough it was kind of tough planning because you can do the grandfather trail, but then you're doing an in and out, and that would have been six miles or something. But so her brother came up with this ingenious plan of getting dropped off at a trailhead, and then there was five of us, Sarah's two brothers, and uh one girlfriend were going to do this hike, and then the rest of the family was gonna go to they had like a hanging bridge and a zoo where there's like black bears and stuff, so they would go to that and we would hike basically back to them from this trailhead. How many miles? Six point it was like just over six miles between six and seven miles.

SPEAKER_03 40:07

That was a good ways.

SPEAKER_05 40:08

So the first part of it was your typical green tunnel, Appalachian mountain hiking. Yeah. Um, beautiful, just absolutely beautiful.

SPEAKER_02 40:17

Is this going where I think it's going?

SPEAKER_05 40:19

Green everywhere. But this first part was like we had 3,000 feet of elevation gain over like three or four miles straight up the whole time. Yeah. And just like I can't just being you have a hiking podcast, you know, and shit saying I'm used to this.

SPEAKER_02 40:36

It's like this is what's up. Like, I was good.

SPEAKER_05 40:39

They were like, Are you uh are you doing good? I'm like, shit, I live out here. Yeah, this is me. It's my identity, right?

SPEAKER_02 40:46

What are you talking about?

SPEAKER_05 40:47

But it was, I kept like guys, I uh I was taking a shitload of photos, uh, tons of fungus. I love seeing all the new fungus that I I didn't recognize before or whatever, and just taking it in, just like, man, there's so much moss. And I kept thinking, like, that'd be good in my turium. Do you think it would last until I get home?

SPEAKER_02 41:06

Um my first thought every time I see moss.

SPEAKER_05 41:09

So just a perfect like three to four mile hike up to this peak, right? And we get to the peak, and we made really pretty good time because I know like when it's all of us on a backpacking trip, like 30 minutes a mile, like we're doing good. That's you know, if you can bust out some miles doing 30 minute miles, slow and easy. How many miles per hour is that? Uh a mile per half an hour. Mile per half an hour, yeah, or two miles per hour. Yeah, yeah. I don't know. Yeah, I don't know the math. I'll check that in editing and if it's not right, we'll cut it out. Was that math? I think it's two miles an hour, yeah. So just slow easy, time to stop, take a break, drink some water. Um, so we but we make it to the peak, and it it's pretty humid out, it's not crazy hot. But there's we get up to the top, and there's like two vantage points. You can go, there's like one to the left and one to the right. And the one to the right is that's the one, the Callaway Peak. So we got to the one to the left first, and it's beautiful. You're on these big rock faces overlooking a valley, then all you know, like Blue Ridge Mountains, everything in the background, just like beautiful, beautiful the rolling hills. Then you look to the right, and there's a there's a storm rolling in. So then we go over to the other, the Callaway Peak, completely clouded in. That storm's there already, and we're like, fuck. How far you got three miles, four miles? You're only halfway through, and we're ridgewalking the rest of the way. Yeah. And then come to find out, like we were looking at our routes afterwards because I was recording it in Gaia and everything. And when we were because the these peaks, you're like climbing, and even one, you climb a ladder to get to the top of the rock. Are you shitting? And you're on the peak. And these are like big, like four by four ladder, like the steps and the the rails are like four by four blocks, like they're huge, thick ladders. You climb up that to get onto this huge boulder. But then we saw like a little bit of a trail, and we're like, I wonder if that's if we're supposed to go there to see this view.

SPEAKER_01 43:11

And I think we all kind of there's a storm coming, and you're like, Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_05 43:19

But what about that view, man? There's a trail leading up. Um, but then like looking at our routes after the fact, like we didn't actually go to the the that it we were supposed to follow that if you wanted to get to because you know, like we went all the way there, but we didn't actually make it go to get to the peak, right? So, anyways, we start heading down and it's like getting dark. We're scrambling, getting trying to get out. Like, we gotta just bust it and get out of here. And then it just starts downpouring, completely torrential downpour.

SPEAKER_02 43:46

Did y'all bring any rain gear?

SPEAKER_05 43:48

No, and that's what I was kicking myself in the ass because every hike I go on, like I always have my raincoat in my backpack, but I had my dry bags, so I put my camera in. And everything in the dry bag, everything I wanted to keep dry, but I didn't only one of us had a raincoat, I think. And it was just like I fucking I always carry a raincoat, and I don't know out of all places to not carry one, that's a place to do it because the storm was just pop up.

SPEAKER_02 44:16

Was it like a a nice, like no torrential rain?

SPEAKER_05 44:20

It was just it was cold, like we all were getting cold.

SPEAKER_02 44:23

But not it it didn't relieve the heat anyway.

SPEAKER_05 44:27

At first it was kind of refreshing, but then you're just completely drenched, everything's soaked. Um, you couldn't operate your phone.

SPEAKER_02 44:35

There's a big difference between a nice like rain while you're hiking and then just like misery.

SPEAKER_05 44:40

And it was like because you would pull your phone out and your touch screen doesn't work when it's too wet. Yeah. Because, you know, like it can't sense your finger or whatever. So I couldn't pull up the map or anything to see where we were at.

SPEAKER_03 44:51

You're wild, we couldn't look at the weather.

SPEAKER_05 44:53

But the like the scariest part, I mean, it got it got like pretty sketchy because you're going, we're on the ridge of Grandfather Mountain for like a good portion of this, and you go out on these huge exposed rocks on the ridge of the mountain, and there's thunder and shit going on. You're like walking on them with water like you had flowing over and like complete, like uh dangerous lightning.

SPEAKER_02 45:20

So you're not walking on like a nice dirt trail.

SPEAKER_05 45:24

No, no, yeah. And it's yeah, slippery as hell, but I was more worried about just lightning because you're exposed, like you're out on a huge rock. That's this is like the one thing you're not supposed to do.

SPEAKER_02 45:35

Yeah, but we looked out of the weather, taking your asses out. Right.

SPEAKER_05 45:39

But that's where we were kind of stuck because I was even trying to look for a place where we could just go huddle and let the storm pass, but there really wasn't anywhere where we can go, so we just kept trudging on. And there were points where when I looked at it on the map, I remember there not really being any side trails, like is there's this one trail takes you out back to the this area that we were going to, and we would get to a point and be like shit, there was like a split, and or there'd be like the trails going this way, and I'd be like, that doesn't seem like the right direction, it's going back up the mountain, and then I would look to my right, and what you thought was a stream was the trail, and just the water was just it was that raining that hard where it was just like a waterfall going down the trail. Oh, dude, and there was like huge, like a huge ravine that we went through at one point that was full of rockfall. Yeah, so you were scrambling on your butt.

SPEAKER_02 46:30

Well, now that you it was now that you say that, I think about what which hurricane was it Helena that came through and just hit that area like so freaking hard. And I imagine the same thing, like trails turned into rivers, like something, you know, and you just got a little tiny taster right there.

SPEAKER_05 46:51

And this area was part of the ones that was hit by that storm.

SPEAKER_02 46:55

Man, yeah, that was kind of scary. It was crazy.

SPEAKER_05 46:58

So and then, like, by the time we got out, it was just barely sprinkling. And I just I can't believe nobody fell, nobody got hurt. Yeah, because it was, I mean, these rocks you're climbing over have no footholds, no nothing. Like you're just scrambling over a huge rock or like down. There was like three to four foot drops you had to jump down, and you're like jumping into a puddle, so you don't really know what's on the bottom of that puddle when you're jumping into. It was crazy, dude. It was that's why it may have been the hardest hike I've ever seen.

SPEAKER_02 47:26

That's pretty sweet experience.

SPEAKER_05 47:28

They would look back at me and be like, You're doing okay. And I'm like, I fucking love it. Like, let's go. That was still kind of lollygagging, but partly because I didn't want to have to stand and wait on these rocks because there was the ladders and shit you had to climb. There was one ladder that had 30 rungs that you had to climb down on one of these rocks. God damn it. So like I didn't want to get stuck out, so I was just kind of lagging back. And I heard, I think I heard Sarah say, like, somebody was like, Is Brad is Brad okay? And she was like, No, like he loves this shit. He's having the time of his life. He's watching you guys not have fun and laughing. But no, it was it it was cool because everybody was definitely like, This is this is definitely gonna be a memory we're gonna talk about.

SPEAKER_02 48:14

That's what we always say. Like, yeah, you you want to have those sunny days, but when when the shit hits the fan, those are the trips that you really don't forget.

SPEAKER_05 48:26

It was awesome, and it was a really cool trail because it wasn't just like a dirt path, like it was a really cool trail. I I enjoyed it. Grand Grandfather Mountain.

SPEAKER_02 48:35

Do you have that camera and like no?

SPEAKER_05 48:37

I definitely I got footage on the first half, but not the second half. I couldn't even take uh photos with my phone because I couldn't use my phone because everything was just soaking wet.

SPEAKER_02 48:48

Yeah, it was it was a crazy what could have used you there to So yeah, you were really in one of those like there's a difference between getting rained on and then everything is just completely soaked 100% no matter what it is.

SPEAKER_05 49:07

Not one single job.

SPEAKER_02 49:08

And that's where you were, and that is definitely an interesting situation to be in.

SPEAKER_05 49:14

And it is just like you just gotta get out, yeah. Yeah, just get out of there. So then we left there, went to Charleston, uh, my old stomping grounds, and this is the worst. Yeah, we did like we were getting hit by the storms leaving the Midwest.

SPEAKER_02 49:31

Yeah, the the same storms that Indiana and Ohio and everybody did get.

SPEAKER_05 49:36

It was crazy. And but we get we spent a full day in Charleston, got out on the water, fucking it like amazing, like always. I always said that was that's my happy place is sitting on the boat, cruising through a marsh. It's awesome, it's so relaxing.

SPEAKER_02 49:51

And you lived in Charleston for however many years.

SPEAKER_05 49:55

And it was it's so humid. This is the worst time of year to go to Charleston because it's so hot and humid. But then it was funny because uh That's what I was thinking.

SPEAKER_02 50:04

Yeah, because I was thinking Indiana sucks. I was like, how bad does it have to be down there in South Carolina?

SPEAKER_05 50:10

I took Sarah on a whirlwind downtown tour and then went out on the boat later that day, and it was just so hot and humid. We were at the beach too, and it's so hot and humid. And then when we get on the water and you're in the marsh, and Sarah's like, Oh, I get it now. Like, this is pretty fucking beautiful.

SPEAKER_02 50:24

When you get out there, does the is it just like the wind that just clears out all the humidity?

SPEAKER_05 50:30

Yeah, it's always there's a constant breeze.

SPEAKER_02 50:32

Does it stick to the land or is it well?

SPEAKER_05 50:35

I mean, and it, but it's also just so beautiful that you just Oh, the aesthetics, yeah. It's definitely not as hot. It's just it's not like any other place. It's hard to explain because say you go to like Myrtle Beach, Fort Lauderdale or something. Yeah, it's city, city, city beach, right? Yeah, Charleston's like city, miles and of marsh, and then the beach, a gigantic bridge, yeah. So there's just all this just pristine marshland inlets and sounds that are huge, and it's just all untouched, beautiful.

SPEAKER_02 51:06

It's basically because well, like Florida, it's you hit the coast and you hit water. Yeah. With South Carolina, it's there's water, islands, barriers, yeah, and all sorts of shit, yeah, shit just to get to the Atlantic Ocean.

SPEAKER_05 51:21

Yeah, it's just a super cool place.

SPEAKER_02 51:23

I've never experienced that before until I went to Charleston down there with you one time, and I was like, man, but I thought we were at the beach like three times.

SPEAKER_05 51:32

Yeah. Danny said, or like Danny's my friend that lives there still. He says the only way to see Charleston is by boat. Yeah. So like even if you go visit Charleston, there's so many tours, fishing tours, dolphin tours, and don't be scared to go on a dolphin tour because I feel like I could take you on a boat and put you on a dolphin. We did when we were out there. What do you mean put me on a dolphin? There'll be dolphins swimming all around the boat. Like a whole pot of dolphins swimming around the boat.

SPEAKER_04 51:59

But what do you mean by put me on a dolphin? To be able to see one. Why didn't you say that?

SPEAKER_02 52:04

Let's just like you were gonna put a saddle on it. I was gonna ride. It's like if you want to see I'll put you on a horse.

SPEAKER_05 52:10

If you want to see an indigo bunting, go I'll put you on an indigo bunting. Like you'll see one.

SPEAKER_02 52:15

What is that? South Carolina talk. That's the thing.

SPEAKER_05 52:19

Yeah. But so if you go to Charleston and visit, definitely go on a boat tour and just say you want to go through the marshes.

SPEAKER_02 52:25

I'm never gonna go to South Carolina without you.

SPEAKER_05 52:29

Well, and I'm talking to listeners too.

SPEAKER_02 52:31

Ah, okay.

SPEAKER_05 52:31

Like if you go to Fort Sumter and go on boat tours. Yeah, yeah. They're awesome.

SPEAKER_02 52:36

I've been I did. You took me to Fort Sumter.

SPEAKER_05 52:38

Patrick went on a boat tour when he he went to Bulls Island when he was in Charleston. We found seashells, shark teeth. It's just like birding or rack hounding. You find a badass seashell, you find a shark tooth, it's just like a little dopamine hit.

SPEAKER_02 52:51

Just finally gotta find more. You never would have said that three months ago.

SPEAKER_05 52:55

Well, I always went shell hunting. Yeah, sure you did. This island had a protected bird nest area. I've never seen so many shorebirds. Hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of shorebirds. It was insane.

SPEAKER_03 53:06

Did you get good picks? Oh, yeah, I got some good picks.

SPEAKER_02 53:08

Yeah. Whoa. Go ahead. But now that we're on the subject, did you add anything to your life list?

SPEAKER_05 53:15

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 53:16

And he pulls out his phone.

SPEAKER_05 53:19

I think I sent a photo to our group chat with uh Chad.

SPEAKER_02 53:24

The grains or the what the hell?

SPEAKER_05 53:26

Well, I was like in this one Herons? I said in this one photo, I have there's five lifers.

SPEAKER_02 53:32

Oh shit. I didn't see that one.

SPEAKER_05 53:34

And it was like a Hudsonian Wimbrel, a black turn, a royal turn, and a black skimmer and an oyster catcher. They were all in wood.

SPEAKER_02 53:46

Holy shit. I know I'm from the Midwest because I never heard of that shit.

SPEAKER_05 53:50

But so I mean it but it was just it was super cool. It was oyster catcher. Yeah. I like that. They look pretty wicked.

SPEAKER_02 53:56

That was a hard name to come up with.

SPEAKER_05 54:00

Look at that bird catching oysters. What should we call it? And then look at that black bird skimming the water. Let's call him a black black skimmer. Yeah. It was cool. There you go, change. It was awesome. And I got some unbelievable photos. What's your count? Oh, um I'm I'm officially at 322. 322. What were you before the trick? And counting. Uh I think 310 or 311. Holy sh. But I still haven't gone through all my photos. And I so I think I know there's a couple more. Uh, some of the highlights, yellow crowned night heron was super cool.

SPEAKER_02 54:38

I tell you what, that one that you sent with the were they the three herons?

SPEAKER_05 54:44

Tricolored herons.

SPEAKER_02 54:45

That's a that's honestly a beautiful picture. And I'm thank you, I'm dead serious on that. I didn't want to say it on chat because I would I don't like to give you too much credit, but oh my god, that's a beauty because every bird is in a different position at a different angle, but they're all very clear, and it's and it's just they're all standing off of one like stitch coming out of the water.

SPEAKER_05 55:14

And one's in flight, and the other ones are all looking at it.

SPEAKER_02 55:17

It's beautiful, dude.

SPEAKER_05 55:18

I think I think those are like fledglings. I think they're really young. No shit. Like this year out of the nest.

SPEAKER_02 55:23

Yeah, they're beautiful.

SPEAKER_05 55:24

Yeah, tricolored hair and super cool photo. And some cool lighthouse photos. Yeah, it was an awesome.

SPEAKER_02 55:30

I can't wait to see the other all your other stuff. We've only got a sampling.

SPEAKER_05 55:34

I took some street photo, like some building photos in Charleston that are pretty cool.

SPEAKER_02 55:38

Yeah, I just did some street art.

SPEAKER_05 55:40

It's almost it's almost like Charleston now. Like I wish I wouldn't spend a whole week there just taking photos.

SPEAKER_02 55:45

Do you feel like you're in a different place when you're there? Oh yeah. Like it's not the place you There's like flashings of flashbacks of but like the I guess the culture of Charleston or the because I remember you were just you loved Charleston. And when you brought us down there and we visited Charleston, we loved it. And then uh at one point, few years or something, you're just like, man, this is it's got to be too many tourists. Yeah, people are just moving here for whatever. It's not they're not part of the Charleston, they're just outside.

SPEAKER_05 56:19

I'm lucky in that Danny, my friend that still lives there, he found his spots where there's no tourists. You need a you can only get there by boat.

SPEAKER_03 56:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 56:28

And you kind of have to know that it's there to be able to even go there. So he found his own little slice of personal beach in Charleston.

SPEAKER_02 56:37

And it's And you said there's like a like the uh the ebb and flow way of the water. Oh, the tides? The tides. There's only there's some secret passageways that you can only take, you know, if you know the tides.

SPEAKER_05 56:52

Yeah, and and a certain kind of boat. Yeah, and that's where we were. Like we were at a spot you can only get to at like certain tides.

SPEAKER_03 56:58

That's pretty cool.

SPEAKER_05 56:58

Yeah. And so it's because even I was telling Sarah, I was like, when I come to Charleston, like I don't I don't go downtown. We don't really do anything except go out on the boat and just do that on the ice. Yeah, it's a blush. Drink beer. There's some kind of rule when you're on the water where like five beers equals one, like you can drink as many beers as you want and you never get hammered. And there's never enough beers.

SPEAKER_02 57:21

If you're on a boat, yeah, you can drink ten beers and you're not even yeah, there's never enough beers on a boat. It's crazy. Well, the the Midwest had this huge storm surge. Yeah, even if you like watch the radio, it was creating storms out of nowhere. Yeah, and a lot of that was when you guys were on the way back, did you run into all that gen too?

SPEAKER_05 57:44

We so we we planned on stopping at New River Gorge National Park on the way home. And we got there the night before, did a couple quick hikes. It was nice out, like sunny, everything was cool. We got a hotel in the area, then woke up the next day, and it was like 8 30, and it was just black. The sky was just black outside, yeah. And that was the storm that had hit India, and even like when you would turn the weather on, it said Midwest to the Virginias or something. And I was just like, Oh, this is a good one.

SPEAKER_02 58:13

We had a whole day of night last week, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 58:16

This week, and then so we hit we hit that storm. It kind of dampened our plans in New River Gorge that day. We still got to go to some of the visitor centers and see some of the sites, but then driving home.

SPEAKER_03 58:28

What state's New River Gorge in? Virginia, West Virginia, West Virginia. West Virginia, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 58:32

It's New River. I need to do more research on this. So it's a new river that goes through this area. It's called New River, but it's the among the oldest rivers in the world, is what they say. Yeah, 300 to 350 million years old.

SPEAKER_02 58:47

Like New York. Like it's one of the oldest cities in the USA. Why are you calling New York?

SPEAKER_01 58:53

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 58:56

But it's it's beautiful. It's I asked the ranger about backpacking because I wanted to get a trail map. She was like, What are you looking to do? And I was like, uh, do you have any backpacking routes? And she was like, What you looking to do, young man? She's like, It's all steep canyons, so there's not a flat, not a lot of flat ground to like make for us to make backpacking trails. She's like, There is a couple, and she showed them to me. And then I was like, Well, what about I saw some shelters? They had like these big shelters with huge fire, like hearth stone fireplaces in them. Yeah. And she said, Those are for day use, but there's campsites around them, so you can like camp there and use those in the day. They have picnic tables and stuff in them.

SPEAKER_02 59:36

So you have to put like the fires out at a certain time, or uh, I don't think so.

SPEAKER_05 59:40

I mean, they obviously have like there was a lot of the Smokey the Bear today's fire uh like level is normal or whatever.

SPEAKER_02 59:51

Um well with all that rain, goddamn.

SPEAKER_05 59:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 59:55

Yeah, pretty yeah.

SPEAKER_05 59:56

But there were some beautiful campsites, beautiful place. I recommend it. I it seems like it is like on if you're on your way through that area, it's a great day or two stop. Yeah. I don't know if I would like plan a whole week like you would Yellowstone, you know, like plan multiple days. It's it's a beautiful, beautiful place. You can spend some time at the bottom of the canyon, at the top of the canyon. It's it's cool. What was the name of you? New River Gorge. It's the newest national park in the United States. Patrick and Baszy.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:24

New River Gorge, the newest national park in the U.S.

SPEAKER_05 1:00:27

And the oldest river in the world. And the oldest river in the world. Yeah. It was Baszy's first backpacking trip, was there with Patty.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:35

Basie?

SPEAKER_05 1:00:36

Yeah. Cool place. Yeah, he got it. He got a crazy thunderstorm when he was there.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:40

What's the crazy thunderstorm when we were there? Well, it's because you weren't with Brad and Traddy.

SPEAKER_05 1:00:46

I know, that's what I kept thinking. I told Sarah that. I was like, we should have had Travis come with us.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:50

You know what's gonna be awesome is you're gonna go on trips and you're just gonna invite me to make sure there's good weather.

SPEAKER_05 1:00:57

Yeah. It's crazy.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:58

Like, hey, you got that playing ticket taken care of. Let's go.

SPEAKER_05 1:01:02

So that was it. Awesome trip. Ready for the next one.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:06

Dude, yeah, that sounds like an awesome trip. And I'm like, I did the the storms and stuff kind of suck, but it sounds like you made the most of it. You embraced it. Yeah. And uh you got your ass back to Indiana.

SPEAKER_05 1:01:21

Hell yeah. Welcome home. Got back, clean up. We got uh a couple more coming up. Kayak trip. We're backpacking southern Indiana in the fall, I think. Knobstone? Yeah, knobstone trail.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:36

Pretty exciting. I uh I told someone the other day they were they were like, where are you going backpacking this year? And I said, Knob Creek.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:44

And they're like, oh, like the whiskey?

SPEAKER_02 1:01:46

I was like, ah, wait. No, I think it's like knobstone. But that sounds good too. Hell yeah. Well, we ready to get out of here? Yeah, did we uh we finish the podcast?

SPEAKER_05 1:02:02

I think so. Without Patty? Yeah, another one. Oh, it's like two, right? Without Patty? I don't know. He was in Austria for one. Oh, yeah, he did do that.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:10

Yeah. Now he's at a fantasy football party. Well, hopefully he'll come back next week. Hey, we need our breaks to do other things. Uh thanks for listening, everybody. Keep on sauntering.